Hold up, lemme spray some of that Hi-Karate to precede my entrance. You should know me better...I'm a Brut - by Faberge - man, just like my Daddy.
(Honestly, that stuff smells like dirty socks, does it not? Used to make me want to puke when Dad got in the car to go to church and he splashed himself silly with the little green bottle).
I'm taking a long weekend. Thought I'd blog now and leave the keys for whomever plans to hang this weekend.
I see there's a conversation about to Zone or not to Zone.
Here's my take on defense and some other things:
You have to zone the drive-and-kick teams, such as Toronto, but the Knicks last season were so poor at the zone, Isiah often had to call it off. When I chatted with Nate last week, I asked him about his on-ball defense. I told him he should be a better on-ball defender, especially with his quickness and strength. He should exhaust ballhandlers who would often cross-over and drive into the heart of the Knick zone, draw a slow-to-react Eddy Curry and the as the defense slides down to help, kick it out for a three.
TJ Ford did it. Mo Williams did it. Kidd and Nash did it...etc.
It's a sequence of events that made the Knicks a bad zone team at times. You can see Eddy hesitates a lot when he's in the paint. Defense is a challenge for him when he doesn't have one man to guard. There are a lot of read-and-reacts. Some fake-and-retreating that have to be done to keep the offense honest. It's a timing thing and yet also a skill acquired with experience.
Perhaps the Knicks should put more emphasis on guard movement in the zone -- Freddy Jones' role? Nate and Mardy are in this equation, too -- and keep the bigs from wandering. Isiah Thomas vowed that the Knicks would be better at perimeter defense this season (he was mainly referring to giving up so many threes because of ducking under screens instead of fighting through them). The point he should make is the Knicks are a big man-oriented offense and a guard-oriented defense.
Curry would find himself 15 to 20 feet from the basket against Toronto, when Rasto Nesterovic would drift out. Chris Bosh is more the Raps' post-up player, so Curry could try to guard him. But Bosh is more athletic and could get Curry into foul trouble if he squares up on him. With Zach Randolph in the picture, what do you do? Have Zach out on Nesterovic? That's going to be a tough matchup for the Knicks in a man-to-man.
What has to happen more often with the Knick zone is rotation. Exchanges can get confusing and messy, but sometimes to keep your big from having to be 15-to-20 feet from the basket, you have to do it.
Marbury showed later in the season he can be a very stingy on-ball defender. Jamal Crawford's defense used to be something that infuriated me, but through the season (before his injury), Jamal showed more effort. Both are quick enough to keep up with guys and smart enough to know how to recover when you are beat.
I have one simple rule of thumb for guards who get crossed-over: once your big man commits, get to the man he left! Even if he's 7-feet, you have to get up on him. Does you no good to chase at that point. Let's say Eddy leaves Nesterovic on the right block to stop the penetration of Ford, the guard has to bust it to Nesterovic to pick off any possible dish by Ford. If Ford tries a lob, that's Eddy's ball to swat.
Too often I noticed a guard would merely recover to the man who beat him and with the big man committing to help, you have two on the ball and no one on the guy who has an open layup. You can't rely on a wing player to swoop down to cover Eddy's man because that allows Ford to kick it outside for a killer 3.
I know it sounds elementary, but what I watched this past season did not resemble what I just described.
The zone only works when you can recover quickly and efficiently.
For Eddy, defense is a frustrating thing mainly because of some habits he has developed as a player. Simple things like having his hands low all the time instead of keeping them up. With your hands low, referees are more often than not going to whistle you for phantom reach-ins and those annoying cheap hip-check fouls that guards know how to draw. Eddy also missed several rebounds last season -- some went right over his head -- because his hands were at his sides.
I know why players prefer keeping their hands down - it's easier to jump. Try it. Stand in place with your hands up and jump. Then jump starting with your hands down and reach up. I guarantee you can touch a higher spot when you start with your hands down. So Eddy has mentally trained himself to be positioned that way in order to leap to block a shot (which he rarely does) or get a rebound.
But watch David Lee, who is a smart rebounder and loose-ball, um, getter. David's hands are generally above his waist and sometimes over his shoulders. He's a quicker jumper than Eddy, so it doesn't hamper him as much. For David, it's not about how high he can get up but how quick he can. I've always said Eddy's problem with rebounding and blocking shots isn't his vertical. If you've ever seen him sky for oops, EC definitely has ups. But his ups are like NASA launches. It takes a countdown to liftoff.
It's going to take me some time to analyze Zach Randolph. His numbers as a rebounder are astounding. I've only seen him play live once -- in Portland -- and what I noticed there was he's great at getting himself position (strong base) and definitely has good timing and hands. In that case, he's a great compliment to Curry.
But on defense...like I said, I have to see it first.
--
Some news:
Stephon Marbury will be on Long Island this weekend on another goodwill tour in the Hempstead area . . . It was reported that Allan Houston is going to work out for the Cleveland Cavaliers. You have to believe if the Knicks even had remote interest, he'd already have a training camp invite. But if you add Houston, then what? Now you need to move three players and the future of Demetris Nichols (a sweet shooter like Allan) is even more in question . . . Orlando PG Jameer Nelson's father went missing along the Delaware River in Chester, Pa. Floyd Nelson worked at a tugboat repair shop and was having lunch near his usual spot by the water when he was last seen. No update yet today after the search on Thursday was stopped because of darkness.
--
Few corrections and clarifications from the mailbag (I was bleary-eyed, but no excuses):
* - I meant Freddy Jones, obviously. Freddy Brown just sticks in my head - Downtown Freddy Brown. Like Rolando Blackman/Renaldo Balkman. Took me a while to get the fingers to type it correctly.
* - The Knicks' closed-practice policy goes back to the 1970s, as I blogged during the past season (again, back when this was all just tumbleweed and crickets). Red never wanted the media watching practice and the rule apparently stuck. Pat Riley was big on it, too. He didn't even let you in the damn building, let alone in the gym. Isiah prefers it too, though I'm going to ask him why when I see him next.
Most NBA teams have closed practices, but there are some -- Denver and LAL -- that don't close their doors. I'd love to watch practice, even if it means having to be at the gym for a longer time. It makes you a smarter reporter and, as a result, your stories have more of a foundation.
* - Cameron Diaz once bragged in an Esquire interview about her flatulence. Chloe tries to hide it but the horse, let's just say the horse's reaction was enough evidence that she wasn't good at hiding it.
I've already said too much.
Enjoy the last weekend of summer. The season is right around the corner.
Comments (50)
Alan,
Have a fabulous weekend and don't hurt yourself. Tahnks for sharing your perspective on the our discussion concerning the Knicks and Zone D or no Zone D....Fellas I am taking my PR Mama out for some salsa dancing to celebrate the Birthday...Have great evening Gents, and I 'll catch up with ya tomorrow...Our Brothers traveling, be safe and be careful, and God Bless!
alan
I 've never mentioned it, but great job on all the photos. your sense of humor is only enhanced with shots the likes of cliff clavin' and yoda. but even the serious photos of the knicks are still great shots.
"When I chatted with Nate last week, I asked him about his on-ball defense. I told him he should be a better on-ball defender, especially with his quickness and strength. He should exhaust ballhandlers who would often cross-over and drive into the heart of the Knick zone, draw a slow-to-react Eddy Curry and the as the defense slides down to help, kick it out for a three."
When Isiah orchestrated the trade for Nate, my greatest hope for the knicks was that he would be a Muggsy Bouges type defender that would pressure the ball for 94 feet. Turned out over the last two years that nate is more offensive minded, more of an aspiring AI than a pseudo GP. hope that will change. we need him to distribute and play d and at times score, but his priorities have to change for the betterment of the team.
The analysis of Eddy Curry lends itself to one conclusion: The NBA never should have allowed high school kids to enter the League. From LeBron to Curry, you still see all the serious fundementals are lacking. These kids get a 4 to 5 year subsidy to learn the game, how to practice, what to focus on, but they have to learn against experienced men, opposing players and coaches who dissect their every move, every weakness.
They should play the NCAA tourney, their college conference tournaments before they get here. The players who have poor work habits, poor instincts, and just poor knowledge of the game can be evaluated at that level. The NBA entry level money they throw at these kids won't motivate them to be the best players they can be. The standards have been set so low that the idea or pro game has to even consider a Zone defense is pathetic. And these kids still cant play!.
This new one year of College rule is also a travesty-what's the point?.
Any kid over 6-10 is going to get a serious look from the NBA, 8th grade and upward. Having the Physical,
mental and emotional tools to play the game has become a luxury instead of a necessity.
Starburyfan
The whole team has to change and I think they are doing the right thing by working out together. We cannot grind out a half court style game if we want to be among the elite! I disagree with whoever posted that these knicks can't run with the Suns and Nets! Marbury is our oldest starter at 30, so his minutes may dwindle to protect his chronic arthritic Knees, but I expect him to be there during crunch time. Nate, Crawford,Collins, Balk, Jefferies, lee, Chandler, Nichols and Morris can hang with the uptempo offense and full court pressing defense. Thats our advantage against Boston and the Nets..... Our depth and ability to change the tempo of the game at any time! If we protect our home court and win 85% of the games in our house, we may exceed a 50 win season! We started a winning culture by going 5-0 in the summer league, and we should try to go undefeated in the pre-season as that only instills a winning Culture!
In your last post you stated that you knew little about Pitino's time as the Knicks head Coach. Well Pitino was in my opinion the best Knick coach since Red Holtzman. He had Ewing,Oak and company playing full court trapping in your face defense. He took over a team that won only 23 games in 1986-87 and made the playoffs in 87-88 with a 38-44 record losing a first round series(the best of 5 opening round back then) against the Boston HOF Bird,Mchale and Parrish team 3-1. His second year the Knicks went 52-30 winning the Atlantic division for the first time since 1971 and won 26 straight home games.
We lost that year in the conference semi's to Jordans Bulls! Pitino did not get along with GM Al Bianchi and Rumors were out there that Pat Riley wanted in as the Lakers we fading, so the speculation was that Bianchi backed doored Pitino after a very successful season and moved Riley in! Pitino left NY a much better club than what he inherited! Pitino also had a big fallout with Bianchi over tradeing Rod Strickland instead of Mark Jackson, That move which I believe very deeply cost us a title! Sorry for the long post, but no going out for me tonight, I'm on call all weekend!
Preach brother Peaceman....
Rod Strickland was one of the best finishers in the game and we traded him. I love Cheeks but he was no Strickland..especially when he was in his mid 30's.
I've been doing some thinking in the last day or 2...which is the reason why I haven't posted.
Something is quietly telling me that we should just stick with what we have and go to war.
Yes I do want Artest but unless Sac is going to take James, Jeffries, Jones, Dickau or Rose. I might consider giving up Nate or Collins but that's a STRONG maybe..especially with Collins who I think is going to be another needle in the hay stack. Does anybody remember his #'s last year towards the end of the season? The kid is a beast all across the board. PPG...RBG & APG..he even had a solid steals per game average.
Wouldn't you guys rather wait until next year where we can just sign Ron without losing anybody?
I don't know...
So Morris pleaded guilty today huh?
Very funny how that gets press....he was caught going 62 mph which was 17 mph over the limit. LMAO...
Posey gets suspended 1 game...big deal...
Pitino would be a great coach for this team....it would force Curry to get in shape. I hope he comes into camp this year ready to go.
Whether it's high school or the NBA, defense is about wanting to play defense. There is enough athleticism on the Knicks for them to be a good defensive team.
If the Knicks don't play better D than last year, making the playoffs will not happen. Run and gun is pretty, but D wins games
N8 should be an all-defensive team member with his quickness and strength. At least John Starks played D for a few years before he fell in love with his shot; Nate has yet to show interest in being a stopper.
Isiah has his work cut out for him.
Pitino was a good coach for the Knicks. Back then, it was all about the 3 (Anyone here old enough to remember "The Bomb Squad?" Trent Tucker, Gerald Wilkins, Johnny Newman, and Rod Strickland.), as soon as they'd get over the 3 point line, they'd let it fly. They also pressed baseline to baseline. They were fun to watch. Patrick had his "Kid 'n Play flattop...
Yo Peace,
I felt the same way about Strickland...we've spoken about it several times. Don't ask me why, but I always thought Jackson was behind Strickland's departure. He always struck me as a "sneaky bastid". They definitely traded the wrong one, that's for sure.
I also enjoyed that 87-88 Knick squad. They played an exciting brand of basketball; all-out, give what you got for as long as you're on the floor, and best of all, "bombs away". This Knick squad is very similar...quick, athletic, long, and at least two-deep in every position.
We've spoken ad nauseum (sp) about the Knicks defensive shortcomings...the debate over zone or not to zone. It's simple fellas...with the athletes on this squad, it comes down to one thing...EFFORT!! They are going to have to buy into the defensive culture COLLECTIVELY....it can't be looked upon as "certain players' jobs"...it's going to have to be a team commitment, or they'll never reach their full potential.
We have the pieces to make it work, and the coach/GM/motivator to pull it all together. Isiah is a master motivator and a gamer. I've watched him for many years. This man has one on all levels. Seen him WILL his teams to victory. Watched him score 25 points in a quarter on a ONE FUGGIN FOOT!!
There is no one more capable of leading these young troops to war than Mr. Thomas.
said, "This man has one on all levels"...
meant to say, "This man has WON on all levels".
Shyt, it's late...yall see what time I posted this???!!
Talk to yall tomorrow....lol
Don
I have that " Bomb Squad" poster tucked away, unopened! Those players you mentioned are on that poster! I believe I got it out of some cereal box! The same players that swept Philly and pushed a BROOM on their way to the locker room, leaving Barkley with a super pissed dispostion! I wish they replayed that on MSG, the look on Barkley's face was "Priceless."
The Knicks have signed Nichols to a one-year non-guaranteed contract to protect his rights. Its clear he didn't want to go to Europe, so the Knicks had no other alternatives. He still has to make the team, but it makes it more likely that the Knicks will either trade Dickau and one other player, or cut two players.
Peaceman
I have that poster too. I got mine as a promotion at a game (I think it was a Monday MLK matinée.).I also have a Ewing poster (I didn't throw mine back on the court like many other people did.), and an Oakley.
The broom incident was great; they took a lot of heat for that.
YAWN!!!! Good morning Knick Fans...
DVJ
you're finally coming around to my way of thinking, and I am ready to go war with the soliders we've got too. And, you and I are on the same page about Mardy...If he can come back strong from his knee surgery and if he has been working on his jumper, If Isiah has the courage, he should start him and play Marbury at the 2, Q at the 3, and their perimeter defense and rebounding improves drastically(If his jumper is better, boy we got something working because teams will have to guard him and double teaming our first pound will pratically impossible,he also has to learn the feed the post a bit better too).
Bronxboy in MD, thanks for droping the true coop in the ealry am, because you hit it right on the head...EFFORT & CHEMISTRY are the operative words for this season;
Peaceman, you were on point with your analysis as well, but ad this name to your equation if he sticks, Jones, CRAWFORD (PG), LEE, JEFFRIES/Nichols/ZACH(depending on the match-ups), BALKMAN in the mix of 2 pound, and we've great D, good rebounding, athletes galor, and 94 feet of all out hell..
Also,Rod was a beast, the biggest mistake the Knicks made, back in the day, although his character was always an issue, we schooled them right bnack in the day in Co-op City in Section Five...Although he didn't liveinthe 5 spot...
Lastly, did you guys hear that the Wizards are sending Andrae Blatche to 'JOHN SCHOOL' due to his recent arrest for solicitation. NOW THAT"S HIALRIOUS...My boy Tapscott is at it again...I've know him a long time and he is riot...
Oh, any of you brothers play golf? On the 14th, Kornheiser and Wilbon are having their annual golf tournament in VA, got the invite, but can't make it cause I'll in the Dominican Republic vacationing...Anyone interested?
Best line on the Strickland trade: I was flying to LA that day. William Goldman – the screenwriter – comes out of the bathroom of the plane (with white powder on his black cashmere sweater) -- hears my friend and I discussing trade. He said:
“I kept waiting for the punchline.”
Set us back years . . .
Fixers,
Peeped in just to get my Fix as promised.
As a former victim in MN, it looks like the chickens have come home to roost. The Veil of Hypocrates unfurled at 12:30 PM TODAY.
Great connects cooleyhigh. Not that I needed it, but it certainly appears like AH elaborated on the defense that I described with the zone. Would you not agree that being slow from the baseline comes from a lack of knowledge about team D and Effort? On both counts we're saying the same thing. (It's not like we NEED to agree as I love to learn.) Team D=Chemistry (your words). Effort=movement (as fast as you can when you're holding all dem coins). If either Z or E are rolling in a "chemistry" team format, you can hide their D flaws (plodding, pounding big fellas).
Two more statements cooleyhigh, is the invite for DR or golf? (If PR mama is staying home, I'd do DR). In another breath, I'd like your inside scoop on ET (who I have referred to as a saboteur in this blog space). The NYers in MD have read that and agree that The Great Equalizer Hates Ugly when we saw the first report about John School for AB. If you can spin that Fredrick F'n Weiss selection, it would help clear a bad taste in my KFL mouth.
Back to the clams and oysters Fixers. Ya'll kno what's good.
KFL
That Knicks team did take a lot of heat for the broom incident – and I’ think a lot of it was justified. At the time, I worried it would come back to haunt them . . . let’s face it, this was only the first round of the play-offs. I didn’t think they’d justified that level of arrogance. Also, it’s usually not a good idea to humiliate a team on their home-court. Healthy exuberance coming off a play-off series win is a great thing, especially for mostly young players. But this seemed to cross a line, whether intended or not, to demeaning the other team. I think there are ways to celebrate without insulting other players. Again, this wasn’t the Showtime Lakers. That display of arrogance seemed a little beyond what they’d achieved at that point. (And, indeed, if I’m not mistaken, that play-off run didn’t last much longer, right? Was this spring of ’89? When they got bounced out in the next round? Anybody have the specifics here?)
who cares Trane LOL...
If we were to sweep the Net's in this playoffs this year on their home court and our players were to bring brooms out...I would have no problem...
That's how it goes when you have a rivalry going on.
I don't condone it but I def won't make a big deal out of it. I do hear what your saying brother Trane...great point !!!
Wow Michigan got upset today....incredible !!!
I'm glad we signed Nichols....
Isiah really had no choice.
KFL, ad some crabs to the list and I'll be over your way in a heart beat...LOL
To answer your question regarding ET, grew up in Middle-class digs in DC and played ball for a high-brow private HS (he couldn't wear the jock straps of Duck Williams, Adrian Dantley, James Brown, Austin Carr, Perry Clark) left there and played ball at Tufts University with some peeps I knew from NYC, left there and utilized his network to gets gigs like a scout for pro teams, he was an agent for a minute too, and he coached at American University. He's sharp and witty Kat, well connected, but his BBALL acumen in overrated due to his inflated thoughts about his own game...If you ask Ed, he would tell you he was being quite nuassanced about FW because of the European invasion and the NYC flava and all, but he didn't know anything about NYC,plus sports fans from the NYC are gritty and very blue-collar and very knowledgeable sports people; but I have never bought it and have told his as much...He left the franchise in shambles and our home boy RA dangling (although, anyone who's says they knew Artest would be this good coming out of St.Johns is FOS and doesn't get no props from me)plus a whole bunch of other talent....Oh, it's golf Baby Baby, cause DR is not in the cards for you unless you've planned your own deal...lol
Peaceman, it was I that said our guards were not currently skilled to the Fast break effectively and efficiently, and I read your post last night and PM you went on some diatribe about Star-crossed being 30,and his body breaking down and dis & dat & dis & dat...What does that have to running the Fast Break...it is real simple Peaceman, if you watch Bird's Celtic, probably one of the least athletic teams, they ran a vicious primary and secondary break because the ball moved through the air and not by the dribble, and these dudes knew how to fillthe lanes wide and take the proper angle to either score or be fouled,plus the big fellas and the shooters on the secondary options were poetry in slow motion...This game is about fundamentals plain and simple...Most ballers today don't even know what they are and most of you posting may not either...It's a real simple game if played the right way, and that will be IT task to get these kids/professionals to play the right way...Now if we want to talk about BALLIN let's jiggy with it...
@ Cooleyhigh,
"This is BBALL Heaven hanging out with you fellas, but I know hell...lol I know you're JC fan and all, so it is clear in the day you were NUT IN YOUR DAY...lol"
Yo, I never met a shot I didn't like, Cooley. They called me "IO" in high school....short for instant offense. Shyt, I had the green light before the expression was coined!! That's probably why I dig Jamal so much..we pretty much have the same demeanor...same body build, and that same "killer instinct". I see alot of me in him.
Yeah, I was a nut back in the day, bruh....hadn't heard that term in a minute...lol.
Didn't Rod go to Truman HS before he went to prep school in VA?
Bronxboy in MD,
I knew it!...lol Rod most certainly did!
What you know about UPTOWN BX?
I must admit, I like what I'm hearing about starting mardy collins. After seeing his poise, I advocated for him to start last year, which he ended up doing coincidentally. When the brawl happened I knew Mardy and Jared Jeffries were true knicks that I want on the team. Where treacherous Mike Breen saw "disgusting and appalling behavior," I saw two young knicks stepping up and making me proud. To see him play like that in the last month of the season was great (something like 14p 6r 5.5a 2st). Yes he had a lot of turnovers to go with those stats but it was basically his first opportunity to get real minutes in the nba. I like how tall he is because he can get eddy curry the ball with all the extra passing lanes, and I like his ability to run the offense. he's also very good and stealing the ball, reads passing lanes very well.
steph and mardy. think isiah would relinquish q and crawford to the bench?
you know what is interesting to me, look at who Isiah drafted this summer, and also keep in mind who is coming off of surgery.
They drafted Wilson Chandler who clearly plays the same position as Quentin Richardson, so you could reason that Isiah might not be too confident about Q's recovery from major back surgery.
They didn't go out and try to get someone like Lee or Renaldo, a rebounder, so Lee is probably going to be alright in terms of health, especially if he's cleared to practice with our country's finest.
And they didn't draft a guard. they didn't draft a point guard, specifically, so they may be thinking Mardy is going to be alright this season in terms of health. Yes they did get back Fred Jones and Dan D, but I'm hoping mardy gets some minutes early this season to see what he's got.
fred jones did kick ass that one season once artest was banned. i was impressed then, but haven't heard of him since.
Yo DJV, we got him thinking about the *Marty Factor* Oh shyt!, the fellas are right he's biting...lol
@Cooleyhigh
Yeah, I watched the Celtics fast break! It was far from Vicious! Unless you are talking about the Two "give me" titles against the Rockets? How can you call those Celtic teams " the least athletic?" Tiny's Celtic's WERE Vicious with a fast break, but the Lakers made Boston's Bird Celtics look goofy as hell when you compare fastbreaking! teams! What does Marbury's 50 year Knees have to do with being able to lead a fastbreak? Your kidding? Right? Cooley's HIGH!
Did any of you guys read this fascinating article?
Check this out...guaranteed to make you say hmmmmm!
Does the FBI really invesitgate every black man that may have just a little influence?
I wonder if they have a file on me even though I have no influence on many people.
The FBI's Pursuit of Wilt Chamberlain's Alleged Gambling
August 31, 2007 1:54 PM
A while ago, I decided to do a FOIA request of Wilt Chamberlain. The main reason I wanted to do it? Someone showed me this cool website which makes FOIA requests of dead people pretty easy. Chamberlain seemed like he was as likely as anyone to have an interesting FBI file.
It came in the mail yesterday. (And, I later learned, the whole thing was online the whole time.)
What you'll find as you wade through the 40+ pages, is that it's almost all about gambling, and while there are a lot of sources saying Chamberlain was a gambler, and the director of the FBI weighs in with memos more than once, there's no proof or corroboration, and the eventually the investigation is dropped. (In fact, throughout the files many anonymous sources are consulted saying they can not confirm the rumors of Chamberlain's various alleged misdeeds.)
It's really hard to know what all this means, if anything. Gambling has long had a hand in sports? Wilt Chamberlain was a problem gambler? The FBI (or their informants) had it out for an iconoclastic young black man?
Read it, and let me know your take.
I'm not the first person to write about this. For instance, The Smoking Gun has many of these same documents online in an easy-to-read manner. Here are some of the most interesting parts of those documents:
Page 1 "[name removed] had advised on April 20, 1966 that Wilt Chamberlain is a very heavy gambler in basketball games in the NBA" and "it is a general opinion that Wilt has shaded points in the professional games that he is a part of and places bets on these shading situations through [name removed]."
Page 2 discusses concerns of a possible fix of the November 2, 1966 game between the Celtics and Chamberlain's Philadelphia team.
Page 3 is a document prepared on November 4, 1966, saying an unnamed informant has learned that Chamberlain had bet a large amount on a game to be played on November 5, 1966. (Philadelphia lost to Boston that day.)
Page 4 tells about an unspecified game in which there was heavy gambling, and Chamberlain played very poorly with a "twisted knee."
Page 6 cites an informant saying Chamberlain is thought to have bet on his own team, but not against his team, and not involving point shaving.
Page 7 has a source saying Chamberlain bet on the Lakers to beat the Celtics in Game 6 of a playoff series.
Page 8 says "it is noted that, during the spring of 1967, the Boston Office had developed information that Chamberlain [several words blacked out] the Boston Celtics were betting heavily on professional basketball."
Page 11 is essentially a memo from Director Hoover saying he wants to know everything about this case.
Pages 12+ are about a totally different incident, where Chamberlain was tired of airline delays and made some crack about shooting somebody, which got everyone all hopped up but ended up being nothing.
I got several more pages of documents, that are not on The Smoking Gun (but you can wade through a big PDF and see all of the documents I got, I think, on the FBI's website). Some highlights:
It is noted that Chamberlain was in Las Vegas for a Caesar's Palace event on 7/2/1969. Another document notes Chamberlain's name on a list of guests who got complimentary stays at Caesar's in January 1968.
Someone is cited having claimed that that Chamberlain bet on Philadelphia for the game on 11/18/1966 against the Chicago Bulls. Then it says "Additionally, [blacked out] told the informant that [blacked out] Boston Celtics, has bet [blacked out] on Baltimore for the Celtics game with Baltimore on November 18, 1966, at Boston." (For what it's worth, Boston won that game by a country mile, so if, as that appears, that's a tale of a Celtic betting against his team, he messed up.)
In a massive sea of blacked out writing is the phrase "Chamberlain's basketball debts."
Another memo notes that Chamberlain complained to reporters of a bad knee when his 76ers played in New York on February 10, 1968 and Philadelphia lost badly. He was quoted saying was unlikely to play the following night against St. Louis. St. Louis became the betting favorites, but then Chamberlain played one of his best games of the year and Philadelphia won by 22.
Cooleyhigh,
Before I get jiggy about it (or is it “jiggy with it?”: I forget), let me tell you that you are a fun read and clearly are a good addition to the family. There are a lot of very unique voices here – better than ESPN the Magazine and I am not kidding.
Now, from reading you I must say it sounds like you are probably the smartest person on this blog. (Is that a good thing?) I caught that little inciteful (not insightful) throwaway: “This game is about fundamentals plain and simple...Most ballers today don't even know what they are and most of you posting may not either.” You must have caught up on your Fixer reading real fast or you just read people fast to be able to make that type of presumption. Either way, I smell perceived talent (or is that skill?) above and beyond what we have ever seen posted here.
Well, unfortunately I think you got me with your throwaway. Admittedly, I got some fundmental holes in my game. So help a body out. Gotta fill that gap. Please tell me what skills it takes to run a fast break efficiently and effectively? Can you also hook me up with a little knowledge and tell me why you think Mardy, Marbury, Crawford, Nate and Fred Jones don’t possess those skills? If you count Qrich as a guard please let me know about him too. Oh and let me know whether there is a difference when the break starts with the guards from when is it is initiated by a rebounding forward or center. I’m not kidding. I like learning. Hook me up. Thank you in advance for the value added.
Somebody claimed that Zeke did not believe his team could run the fast break last year which is why he was playing half-court offense and feeding the post. That poster is suffering a bit of memory loss. As you may recall, from summer league on (with Mark Aquirre as coach), Zeke was working on developing two units, one of which was to emulate the Phoenix style-offense (supposedly the reason, along with defense, for drafting Balkman). He continued thinking he could make that happen until the brawl cut his roster short. In addition, the improved play of Curry cut a little into that second unit theory, except that it was the up-tempo game that made up for many of those horrid double digit deficits.
Oh, I hear folks pining for Collins to start. Not much to argue there, because if all of Cooleyhigh’s ifs are satisfied, Mardy should be an all-star in a couple of years. But, clearly because of the ifs, he will not be starting anytime soon. I have a feeling that three guard sets will be very popular with IT this year though. As always, it depends on the matchups and what coach thinks works against opposition. IT has a lot of responsibility and will have to make some difficult decisions that were made for him by providence (injuries, Stern) last year.
I’m old school so I don’t like arm chair coaching by numbers (1-5). I like playas that will play regardless of the positional number you want to assign them. But I imagine that’s why I’m writing to you guys instead of hanging out in some coach's office. With that said, Marbury at the two is only good as one of several options, not as a regular offensive diet. I know many people refuse to accept Marbury as a point guard, but he has good pg skills. His problem has been decision-making which is often the problem with a shoot first mentality guard. Many shoot-first guards have made the same transition Marbury must complete. In fact, he has made great strides and right off the bat poses multiple problems for defenses because of his ability to break down the defense, pass off the dribble, penetrate toward the basket, pop mid-range and wet the tre. I think some of us are forgetting the importance of getting to that foul line and getting into the penalty ASAP. That happened best for the Knicks last year with Steph on the ball, not off it. As long as Steph can improve his decision-making which I think comes with practice and playing the game, he will be an excellent starter at pg, IMHO.
Regarding, Curry as a rebounder: I hear AH. I love the detailed description from Alan and respect the fact that he is there at ground level. Unfortunately, his analysis makes it seem as though EC is not too bright compared to a rebounder like David Lee. If that is the case, we are in trouble and should expect it to be a struggle for EC to catch on to the nuances of playing defense. I pray that what is closer to the truth is that Eddie is not skilled at rebounding because he has not been trained to rebound. From listening to Qrich, Eddie was such a force in highschool that he never really exerted himself. Eddie was so big that whatever rebounding he did came naturally. It is apparent that when he came to the pros directly from high school either no one taught him the fundamentals of rebounding or he was not really motivated to learn – or more likely a combination of the two.
I don’t know a lot about what it takes to be a smart rebounder, but I am sure that body positioning and understanding the possible direction a ball will take after hitting the rim or the backboard has a little something to do with it. Players like Rodman, Bird, Lee, and Russell actually studied and practiced rebounding. I do know for a fact that a little guy like me can out rebound a big athletic guy often just by blocking out and anticipating the bounce of the ball. It’s not that I’m naturally smarter (my personal code, does not allow me to be the smartest person in any room for more than ten minutes, because if I believe I am the smartest person in the room and I decide to stay, I will quickly be the dumbest person in the room from an inability to learn from others), I just studied the bounce of the ball because otherwise I would never get it.
I checked out the videotape to refresh my memory and of course Alan described Curry’s jumping technique nicely. However, I noticed that he had his hands over his head a lot, but he was usually out of position. He does need help and you guys who said Ewing would have been a great resource are right on the money although I don’t advocate telling Zeke who to hire. I will suggest that there is a need he must fulfill and with all due respect, Herb Williams has not taken care to make sure Eddie can rebound yet.
That’s my two cents. So break me off some of that jiggy sauce Cooleyhigh. I wanna get closer to where you are, fundamentally speaking that is.
Peace.
Peaceman, what is wrong with you? Don't you know you don't need knees to run a fast break? I thought I already imparted that wisdom to you. What's up with that, cuz?
lol, LIVES,
Your right!
How could I forget about Joe Bard?
The #1 fastbreaking wheel chair Guard!
The ball never touched the court and the lanes were filled with layup/shooters!
Joe's team had no legs or knees, but had a turbo-charged wheel chair Scooters!
My Bad, Cooley, share a toke of that "Chronic" which ya boys!
Peace my man, I'm ROFL.
My bad, I forgot to wish CooleyHigh a belated Happy Birthday, unless your B-day is two weeks long like mine (Mommy (SRIP w/ all my love) complained about that long labor). Happy B-day man. I think I speak for Peace, Steady, Bronx, Statesman and the crew when I wish you well and tell you that we're glad to have someone else willing and likely to take some blows for a change. (Smile).
LIVES, I posted what you ask for, but for some reason it is being inspected ny the posting elite, I mean police...I got a different message after my posting so I hope it cuts mustard, because I don't want to write it ALL OVER again...Let's wait and see....
LIVES, PEACEMAN, Damn, I dropped a straight Classic and it was TIMELESS....It was every where I ever been and better than I ever been...It was like "Pa-dow, Pa-dow; Bangin! I'm hopeful they play the Ole School rift on the Bene's of the Fundamentals...I have no doubt it will be #1 on the BBALL Charts...I guess I'll be patient...Until then Bruhs, Keep it Poppin!
Cooley, it won't show up. If you used a cuss word or perhaps too many hyperlinks they won't let it through.
As a general rule, when you do the long classical material, do it on your wordprocessor first.
Perhaps, you can ask Alan to ask the webmaster or whatever you call it to e-mail it back to you. In fact, I think Alan can send it back so that you can clean it up.
http://knickscentral.blogspot.com
http://knicksdefense.com/
Case For Collins.
Basketball is a game of chemistry & balance. Starting MC w/ Steph at the 2 gives you both. Offensively you have an individual that is looking to blend and does not need a required number of shots to contribute. This also allows Steph to spend most of his time at the two and to use his strenghts as outline by 'Lives'. The second most important attribute that you want in a point guard is sound decision making, (I heard athleticism was the most important). Generally this can be taught to guys early in their career. However if a point guard is 30 years old and he still does not know how to control a game, the odds are slim that he will learn these nuances at such a late stage. Some believe that point guards are not made they are born. If Isiah goal is for the team to maximize its potential then he must put everyone in position to excel. Putting Steph at the 2 improves the team. Steph knows this as well. He did ask Con-Man Brown to let him play the 2.
Starting MC not only makes the first team better, but it also improves the 2nd unit. JC and Nate have chemistry that goes back to their old Seattle days. In addition w/ JC on the second unit you have added a scorer, and and individual that can create his own shot. If the 2nd unit has Lee, Balkman, & Jeffrys up front and Nate & MC in the backcourt, then you have an offensively challenged unit. JC changes the dynamics of the 2nd unit. Personally, I do not believe in substituting by units. When you bring in mass substitutes you are bringing in 4-5 guys who are cold and not in a rhythm. If the other team does not sub this way then you could have 4-5 cold guys playing 4-5 warm guys. Not a good situation. Hopefully Isiah will use the gradual sub pattern so that he always has players who are warm on the floor.
Running fast-breaks and secondary breaks are from a different generation. Because players are supposely better athletes (and athletes always win), coaches are not really teaching guys how to run the break. I thought the point guards did not know how to run the break, but the more I watch, I realize that guys on the wing do not know how to fill the lanes. Todays version of the fast-break is one guy dribbling down court w/ his head down and driving to the basket. The secondary break is the point guard passing to someone at the 3pt-line, even if there is a 3 on 1 advantage. Yes this is what the better athletes are bringing to the table. Certaintly Kidd and Nash are not in this group.
Peace
Statesman,
Excellent stuff as usual.
You didn't say anything I disagree with, yet I think we are about 1/2 a season away from Mardy starting. Ae usual, we are on the same page about this chemistry, balance and decision-making combination. Yet, Mardy-Marbury hasn' been proven to tap the chemistry side of the equation just yet. You're assuming that because there is balance that there should be chemistry. Not a bad assumption of coourse, BUT, what do you expect Zeke to do with the Crawford-Marbury-ECity chemistry that was built? Don't even bother to answer States because the more I think about it, as far as we know, the chemistry thing is shot until ZBo gets time on the floor and to start it would not be a bad idea to have someone who doesn't need the ball, who is a good on-ball defender and can feed the post starting with this revamped team. I still think we are at least an all-star game away from that lineup.
Great, great points on the fast break and athletes (LOL). Thanks. I didn't want to steal any Cooley thunder, but you hit it right on the head from beginning to end, it's the bigs that are really the problem. It's not that hard to run a fast break if "everybody" does their job.
(Oh States, I agree that it is usually hard to develop that decision-making skill the more b-ball you have behind you, but I would suggest as I did above that Marbury has shown the caacity and desire to improve in that regard).
Please stop with the Marbury at the 2 fantasy. He is the best orchestrator in half court offense we have and should start at the point, period. Mardy will do well with Nate at the 2 switching on D where Collins guards opposing 2s. It will work great you'll see.
As a matter of fact the second unit with Balkman Lee Nate and Collins is primed to run and gun because of their rebounding and steals. They make a perfect change of pace from the half-court game run by the starters. Leave the team the way it is and keep Nichols somehow. The Knick are gonna be a force this season.
Collins had off-season knee surgery, and has been sidelined. It's unfortunate, given the way he finished the season. Hopefully he'll be able to get himself into shape and pick up where he left off. Marbury isn't going to play the two. Last year was a great year for him at the point because he bought into Isiah's plan. At this point in his career, Marbury needs to play less minutes, to help prevent him from getting worn down as the season progresses. I'd like to see Marbury get about 30 minutes a night, with Collins and/or N8 getting the rest.
Hello, I am one of the people that read the blog but never post. Most of your work is excellent guys and you fill the void for Knick news during the offseason.
Ok, to my post. I see everyone speculate on the starting 5, so I figure I'd post mine. This is all depending on an effective Jeffries and a healthy Q.
PG - Steph backed by MC
SG - Q backed by Jamal
SF - JJ backed by Balk
PF - Zach backed by Lee
C - EC backed by Morris
deep bench DNick, Nate, Chandler, Rose, Jones or James (please no)
I think each position is filled nicely w/ this line up. I see that most people here think that Jamal should start. Is that because of his scoring prowess, or is it because you guys don't have faith in Q's health ? I think starting Jamal leaves a hole in the D. He is a weak defender and starting Q at the SF makes us shorter as a team. Imagine starting a lineup of 6'11", 6'9", 6'11", 6'6", 6'2". Jamal is 1st off the bench and could probably end up as 6th man of the year as the primary scorer on the 2nd squad. I'm basically looking for some feedback as to whether you all think that this proposed lineup would work or if I'm off base. TY in advance.
Oh by the way, this is only if the Knicks decide to stand pat and not deal a 3 for 1 ( Nate, DD and Jones ? ) for Artest. Then Ronny starts at the 3 obviously but the scheme doesn't change that much.
JohnQ,
Crawford is going to explode on people this season, besides QRich is better at 3.
How did Jeffries crack the starting line up? Who the hell is he Ron Artest?
Rush,
JJ is no Artest by a long shot, but if he can do what we got him for I think he makes the lineup. I think having him at the 3 shores up our perimeter D. I'm not sold on the defensive intensity of Zach or EC, so the more D on the court the better.
I say we start
Marbury
Q
Jeffries
Zach
Curry
Jeffries is going to surprise a lot of people this year. Why do we clown him when we know he missed almost 30 games last year? The guy can play defense and he's been working hard all summer. If I were Isiah, I would give him a chance but for some reason I think Isiah is going to go with the 5 of
Marbury
Crawford
Q
Zach
Curry
I also agree that with Crawford, Lee, Balkman and Nate cominig off the bench....it would be a very, very nice change of pace from the half court flow of the first unit.
Is it me or are we one of the deepest teams in the league?
When does the Isiah Thomas sex trial start?
I don't think Isiah is going to make anymore moves this off season. To tell you the truth if he doesn't I won't be mad. I think the team he has put together indeed has a chance of making some noise in the regular season as well as the playoffs.
People don't really understand the magnitude of what we did when we got Zach. Zach is a KG at a cheaper price. The only thing KG actually does better than Zach is dunk. Zach never dunks the ball unless he is WIDE open. KG will dunk on somones head once in a while. Everything else is on a even level. Like I said before, I've been watching Zach since MS and he was nowhere near what he is now. He wasn't even considered a NBA prospect when he was in college. That's how I know he's a gyn rat and I know he's working on his game all summer. He understands he has a once in a lifetime opportunity to play in the mecca of basketball where we appreciate players like him because of his skill and basketball IQ level. Similar to how we appreciated LJ after his back surgery.
Zach is going to flourish this year and Curry will either follow or get left behind. Curry could gain a great deal out of this if he plays it right. If they ever become comfortable with each other on the blocks and free throw line extended.....it will be impossible to stop them. I'm not even being a little funny......THEY WILL BE IMPOSSIBLE TO STOP.
Alot of people went to the youtube to get a briefing on Zach.....uh uh...you cannot get the full understanding from watching that. When you see him play you will see that he has the chance to be top 2-3 Knick power forwards of all time.
The countdown has officially begun. Football season begins this week. I have my fantasy team ready to roll.
I can't get over how close basketball season is. I'll really start getting the chills when I go on vacation in October. I know when I come back it'll be time to go !!!!
DVJ
To be a top 2-3 all-time PF for the Knicks, that means passing DeBusschere and his 2 championship rings; and Oak, at the very least. Also to be considered; Hall of Famer Harry Gallatin, and Mase. I think we can bypass Larry Demic for that list.
Can somebody explain to me how a six foot 42-year old man beat all those new generation athletic New York b-ballers in the "Last Man Standing" competition?
http://www.nba.com/knicks/news/lastmanfinals.html
LOL. LMAO. ROFL. Hurray for old men. Guffaw. Guffaw
Jeffries is a brick layer with a brain of a pigeon as far as basketball IQ is concerned and should be out of the rotation. Yes he is athletic but not nearly as good as Balkman. So for all you defense lovers Balkman should start ahead of Jeffries. QRich is an excellent defensive player also and has all the other skills and a 3point shot to play the 3. He should start and Balkman should backup. Crawford is a lock at the 2 by the way and I'm hoping to see some 40-50 point games out of him this season. There is no way he comes off the bench. No way.
LNJ,LNY
The reason a 42 y.o. man won is the same reason why the most athletic player isn't necessarily the best player; you need brain to be a successful basketball player. Guys like Magic and Bird weren't the best athletes, but they knew where the ball was going 2 plays before it happened.
What's Up Fellas!
JohnQ, welcome aboard, and I like your style slice because you read and observed and analyzed the situation before posting. Smart Move Youngbuck...lol
Plus, I like your line-ups, and although if MC is healthy and stealthy with his game I might consider going another way, but kudos on your thinking, and I believe your right about JC, he is our version of Ginobli off the bench and in the game at the end if scoring is required. IT goes another way if defense is needed...
Rush, what's up with defaming the bruh's (JJ)intelligence? Based on your posts, I don't find your BBALL IQ all that impressive and if you've got make points slamming one based crude comments verses fact and first-hand knowledge, I KNOW FOR YOU HAVE NO GAME EITHER, so you really ought to check yourself before you wreck yourself. Everybody has a flaw or two in their game, and in other aspects of their lives, just like all of us posting. You don't sound like a fan Rush, you sound like a fiend, and spewing that crap is offense...Post your thoughts and opinions but be decent bruh...If I strcuk a nerve it was my intent, but not to relegate, only to elevate...Rush, I look forward to your next missive...
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