My column today talks about hybrids, from Bengal cats (I covet them!) to flowerhorn cichlids (if the fish's markings resemble Chinese calligraphy, he is said to be lucky).
The "hybrids" that we are most familiar with are "designer dogs," from cockapoos to goldendoodles to puggles.
I've always taken exception to these crosses, thinking them glorified mutts, and arguing that when you cross, say, a cocker spaniel and a Jack Russell, you are playing genetic roulette. You can't guarantee what your "Jackapoo" will look like, how big he will grow, or how he will behave. Not many people can handle a terrier temperament -- and Russells are the apex of earthdogness, little mosquitos on crack zipped into dog suits.
But -- step aside while the lightning bolts from my fellow purebred fanciers wing their way to me -- I have a lot of trouble finding fault with one of these crosses: the Labradoodle. It is one of the few hybrids with a purpose -- to provide a relatively hypoallergenic guide dog. Both breeds meld beautifully, both in terms of their appearance and temperament. And because the breeds have different genetic problems, these first-generation crosses have hybrid vigor.
The same argument applies to the lurcher -- traditionally, a sighthound crossed with a herding dog or terrier, developed hundreds of years ago in Great Britain and Ireland for poaching because the ownership of greyhounds was restricted to the nobility. (Gypsies are credited for popularizing these dogs, and word "lurcher" is said to derive from the Romani word "lur," meaning "thief.") The classic lurcher combination is a greyhound crossed with a collie; Whippet x Beddlington is also popular. These dogs have the speed of their sighthound forebears, with the nose and often biddability of the other parent.
So ... if a reputable Labradoodle breeder does the appropriate healthy screenings recommended by the respective parent club of each dog, and the puppies are sold on spay-neuter contracts with a return-to-breeder clause, is there really anything wrong with this? (Other than the argument that any selective breeding of any dog, purebreds included, just adds to the overpopulation problem.)
What do you think?
Comments (25)
The late George Padgett, professor emeritus and geneticist from Michigan State would beg to differ. In his book and in his lectures he states that hybrid vigor does not exist in purebred dogs. And I really fail to see the advantage a labradoodle has over either a purebred poodle or a purebed lab. Both are used as guide dogs in their original state. If you need a hypoallergenic guide dog - get a poodle. And I must contradict you -- they DO share health problems. Hip dysplasia and PRA are two that come to mind immediately.
There's a Labradoodle in my neighborhood, and it's friendly enough, but it's kind of ugly. and really big. Are they crossed with standard poodles? I just can't get into them. You can dress these crosses up with whatever cutesy names--A puggle, shizapoo, or labradoodle, but it is still a really expensive mutt. I think they are stupid when shelters are full of really great mutts (and purebreeds too! My Samoyed is from a shelter)
I have the patience for Himalayan grooming, and yet if someone had not crossed a siamese with a Persian they would not exist.The same goes for other show cats such as the Ragdoll-- Persians are part of their background too-- they just shed less and don't have the undercoat (yeah!)McGee was a gift but Minou is a rescue persian, and I think that with all the rescues in the world-- cat or dog-- that's the way to go.
We have a new pet store in our area. I love to go see the puppies, no not buying any. They had a bug
that would be a cross between a beagle and a pug. BUT what bothers me, when I asked where they came from the clerk said oh the boss goes out to Kansas to pick out the puppies. What do I think? Too many strange and bad people are trying to make a buck.
But on the other hand a real breeder - the crosses for guide dogs I think is alright. I support Mira, a guide dog foundation that breed Burmese Mountain dogs and labs. They are wonderful, and they know where every puppy goes, even into retirement.
I understand that the real name for a beagle/pug mix is a Puggle not a Bug. I could be wrong but, that is what I understand.
Puggle sounds better. I will go with Puggle
my daughter has two puggles and they are very good dogs.good watchdogs also.
Labadoodles are cute but like anything else because of their cuteness they are being bred by anybody who has a poodle or a lab to just any dog of the other breed in hopes of making big bucks off the litter! No finding the right mix, checking health of the parents or granparents, or disposition of any.
a labadoodle, puggle, cockapoo, are all MUTTS that cost a lot of money to buy. Go to the pound and get a mutt for very little cost and save a life!!!!
I work with a rescue group www.ny-petrescue.org
The dogs that are dumped in shelters or found in the streets are sickening. Shut down the puppy mills, give these dogs already born into a miserable life a chance to be loved, thats all they really want. I have a foster dog now who came to me after delivering 2 pups. Well I just got the pups adopted after much screening of applications and they are 10 weeks old. Mom is the BEST dog and was a great momma and I am looking for a home for her now. Stop cross breeding, rescue, get these dogs into loving homes, give them a chance. I have two rescue dogs, a Jack Russel and a Cocker Spaniel that were dumped, two great dogs and very, very smart. I hate what goes on in this high kill shelters, its criminal. They are euthanizing because of lack of space and yet they are breeding and cross breeding for money and who suffers, Gods creatures. When will it end.
Sorry, but genetics are just not that simple. Just because you breed a lab and a poodle does NOT mean that you are going to get a hypoallergenic dog. And just because you breed two different breeds with two different sets of problems does NOT mean that you are eliminating those problems.
My biggest problem with these designer breeds is the outrageous prices that people are charging for them! There is NOTHING wrong with a mixed breed. They are AWESOME dogs and some of the cutest dogs on earth. BUT go to your local humane society and RESCUE one.
I received a birthday card with the following quote from Max Lucado- It just struck me as appropriate.
"Next time a sunrise steals your breath, or a meadow of flowers leaves you speechless, remain that way. Say nothing and listen as heaven whispers,
"Do you like it? I did it just for you!"
Creator God, we praise You for the beauty of Your world in the Springtime. We remain speechless in the face of Vivi's beauty, speed and grace! We marvel at the charisma that shines from photos of Biggie. Sniffle's shy charm, and intuitive compassion make us smile-- in spite of his sad story. We know that You made them "just for us" to "meet", and You brought all of us together in love to help them. How can we not pray to You with confidence for their rescue?
Find them a safe place for them as night falls. Light their way with Your moon and stars, and keep them warm in Your loving gaze. Thank you for the healing that is taking place in Madison, Dante and Murphy! Rejoice in the travellers who will meet you tonight in Paradise. Lay out some special treats for our animal companions who have gone ahead. Bless and protect Vivi's angels as they struggle to be your human presense on Earth. Send Your angels to help them. Protect Darlene from bees, and bees from Darlene. (We never knew bees liked liverwurst!;))Watch over us too, so that we do not lose us our way to You. Let this experience strengthen our faith in You, regardless of its expression, or tradition. Let us sleep in the hope that tomorrow will be the day that these animals return to their parents! Let us sleep well knowing YOU ARE IN CHARGE!
What I dislike about the entire "designer dog" thing is that they are in fact MUTTS. They are not some "designer" dogs.. By trying to promote them as such, it only shows that these people are trying to make $$$, not develop a new breed. What is the point of a beagle and a pug?? By promoting them, you are only promoting the BYBs to just go out and breed any two dogs and make some quick money. The BYB's that used to just breed to AKC dogs to make a couple hundred on a "AKC PUREBREED PUP" are now making thousands per pup on a two mutts!!!
I personally love mutts as well as purebreeds. I do rescue work. I dont like to see these "designer dogs" getting publicity because in the long run, these are the animals that are going to end up filling the shelters. I know a few people that have had "labradoodles" and their temperment was terrible! They ended up in shelters. These "breeders" are targeting a market of people that want the "in" dog. These people are buying spur of the moment, and the dogs are suffering...
I have a lurcher, saluki x german shepard dog, that I found at the Humane Society. Every time I walk him in a populated area people comment on how interesting he looks (he is very handsome and fluffy) and how they would like to have a dog like that. He has no health problems, he's funny and smart and loyal. I'd give anything to have another dog like him. However, I am a strong believer in adopting dogs from shelters. His skin won't get saved for cloning, I won't make any particular effort to find another just like him because there could never be another dog like him. But I will always want another lurcher. So I guess I have to come down on the positive side of cross breeding. But in a controlled way, the way the Silken Windhounds have been developed. I don't think all these 'doodles' have strict breed standards.
Also, just to say, the volunteers who have been searching for Vivi are wonderful. Thank you-I so hope that she is found.
Everyone/anyone,
What's happening to Sniffles? Last news was that Bobbi (& the strays) was going to help out although his owner seemed very down about his chances.
All the searchers for Vivi, wish I could be there but can only send hope and love.
Neila & Oliver Wendell Whippet
Who ever started the whole "designer dog" thing should be shot. I think it was just a person who one day thought it would be fun to start crossing different breeds regardless of what the out come would be and charging a fortune for them. Not thinking that probably half of them would end up in shelters or just dumped for health issues, temperment problems, or other unforseen things. We already have an overpopulation of unwanted animals in this country, why add to it?
Reputable breeders go to extra lenghts to do health testing weather it's OFA, CERF, cardiac, thyroid, full blood panels, I could go on, to insure the healthiest dogs possible. Then they spend hours upon hours trying to find the right stud dog to take to a brood bitch to make sure that the pedigrees match the way they want. These new 'designer' breeds have such a small gene pool that they are already inbred. Not good! When you do first generation crosses you get such a wide variety of dogs in the way they look and act it's no wonder they end up in a shelter. So to those that are breeding them, find a better way to spend your time than taking other peoples money for a dog they can get from a shelter for 1/3 of the price.
Bravo Melisa!
I AGREE COMPLETELY!
MY MOTTO IS: DON'T BREED OR BUY WHILE OTHERS DIE!
MY lab/rhodesian is the BEST animal that has ever adopted me. Do I want another someday? If he or she chooses me, maybe. Do I want to pay someone to try to make more like her? NO WAY. If we put 1/5th of the resources that are wasted by breeders into rescues and shelters, maybe we could pick and choose the crosses we want. In the meantime, to find the cross you want - or to let the cross that wants YOU - VISIT YOUR LOCAL SHELTERS!!!
Good Morning. Postings are getting farther apart lately.
i'm a pro-trainer, & am appalled at the sheer gluttony of breeders who "cashed in on" the Lab-doodle idiocy.
the Labra-Doodles who have been bred in Aus for abt 30 YEARS are still throwing surprises, in shedding coats, unexpected size, joint probs, eye or skin probs, etc.
so how in heaven's name could some gormless twit with a male dog of either Lab or Poodle breed, & a female of the other
[they frankly don't give a hang which is who... nor do they do ANY testing, overwhelmingly; the few who actually do any tests do the abso minimum, might be Bang's disease on one or both , perhaps HD-rads rating on the Lab side, =maybe= CERF cert's on one or the other but rarely both, NEVER that i've heard of any skin-punches for SA in the Poodle parent, or any elbow-rads for UAP in the Lab parent, etc; they're in it to max their bottom line, & to hell with the dog's health, the pups' health, the parent-BREED's health, or any heartbreak for the crossbred-pup's owners...].
i've spoken to Lab-Doodle breeders who BRED THEIR BITCH ON HER FIRST HEAT, to a stud with MULT LITTERS, who didn't bother doing a Brucellosis blood-test! they're breeding a 9-to-12 yr old "girl" equivalent dog, to the correspondent of a multiple-partner sexually-active older man, & they don't STD-test?
their young F can have serious lifelong joint probs after breeding too young, to say nothing of her carrying unknown bad-genes that haven't had time to SHOW in her life as yet [85% of heritable defects show by 2 yrs age; she's 6 mos].
let's be candid: this is NOT about "hypoallergenic"; it's abt ca$h.
As a service dog trainer, I've worked w/ a number of "labradoodles".......also many labs, standard poodles, and lab/ golden crosses. I am also currently fostering a labradoodle. Just by breeding two breeds, you don't automatically get the best of either parent/breed. Labradoodles shed a lot, like labs. Some are very smart, some not so much. Some have good hips, some are dysplastic. Like both labs and standard poodles. As a trainer who works w/ all these breeds regularly, I can't see any real advantage of these designer breeds. And the amount of money involved is riduculous. If a service dog program is doing careful, thoughtful breeding of health and temperament screened dogs, that's one thing.......like the lab/ golden crosses. But these people who are trying to capitalize on the "designer" trend.......that's a shame.
The Italian Greyhound puppy that I posted about last week was bought at a pet store in Manhattan -- $1,000 -- "marked down fro $1800 because the store was going out of business" The owner proudly showed me her "pedigree papers", I saw some name on it and an address in Missouri. People believe the crap that they're told by the sales people in these stores. Now the owner of this 5 month old puppy wants to sell her and she wants $600 plus more for the crate and supplies she bought...I've been depressed all week over it.
Somebody brought in a "goldendoodle" to where I work a few months ago, another poor "designer dog", the owners said they special ordered her (pet store of course) and paid $3,000 !!! well the poor half grown puppy had to have bilateral hip surgeries, they brought her to me for therapy just once and she was in so much pain even with meds, the never brought her back...I'm almost afraid to call.
Then we had a woman who bought a Golden puppy from someone who was very highly recommended her on LI, I think she paid $1,700 and the dog has two horrific hips, will need surgery (and the docs I work with try to avoid surgery if possible. Sometimes we can). Many of these defects don't show up until the dog is older,like the 2 newfies I've seen with rotational deformities of the thigh bones. I hope to see the puppy mills go in my lifetime, but there's too much $$ in them and people shut their eyes to the truth when they see the puppies in the window. What responsible breeder would sell a litter of puppies to be shipped to other states for pet stores? And then there's the crap that the puppy farms "are all licensed and USDA inspected." Yeah, like the labs, etc.
I am a lover of Lurchers I have just come back from the UK with two puppies because I could not find any here in the USA. My Lurchers are female saluki/greyhound cross and my male is greyhound/lab cross, I have had the saluki/greyhound before and they make the most wonderful pets. Mine was a great hunter even though I never trained him, he could catch a squirrel in the blink of a eye. The male I have now is not one I have ever seen before but he is the calmest puppy (hes 13 weeks) I have ever knowwn. When I stop while out he sits and waits so as far as breeding goes both these dogs are just great.
so the problem isn't breeding hybrids, the problem is irresponsible breeding and irresponsible pet ownership. Anyone who gets a Jack-a-poo should at least be prepared for it being Jack like. If you get a pet and then decide you can't handle it, YOU are the jerk not the breeder. Health defects affect purebred dogs just as much if not more than hybrids, there are just as many disreputable purebred breeders as there are hybrid breeders. People set the prices they are willing to pay, why should a pug cost more than a puggle if they are both healthy dogs? I love my Jack-a-poo and wouldn't trade her for the world, I'd consider some day in the future breeding Jack-a-poos, doesn't make me a puppy miller, makes me someone who sees how great these pups are and wants more people to be able to enjoy their company. The shelters are filling up fast, they have been for a long time, is it the fault of hybrid breeders? Do the breeders drop the pups at shelters? The way to curb the puppy mill problem is to be more aware of who you're buying your puppy from, reporting neglectful/abusive breeders and doing your homework, it isn't not breeding hybrid dogs for people who love them.
All this downing of Labradoodles?!?!?!? Why! Backyard breeders and puppy mills have been around long before there were Labradoodles, puggles, goldendoodles. I can defintely understand about disreputable breeders who want to cash in, but why put ALL Hybrid breeders into the mix? Not every breeder is the same and I know of Labradoodle breeders that have done their research and clearances and have Health Guarantees on all of their puppies, I being one of them! Look around, what if the #1 dog in America? The Labrador Retriever....how many Labs will you find in shelters around the world....more the doodles. Yes, there are Labradoodles that end up in shelters, but the main reason is not because of the breeder(if they are a reputable one), but because the owners did not do their homework first and understood the particular hybrid they were buying. Don't bag all hybrid breeders into the same pot because like the purebred breeders we are not all the same. If you do not care for a Labradoodle, Goldendoodle, Puggle, etc then don't buy one. If everyone was alike what a boring world this would be.